[gecko]Li'i isn't cooperating!
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Mon, 9 Jun 2008 01:34:10 EDT
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> Subj:Re: [gecko]Li'i isn't cooperating!
> Date:6/8/08 9:37:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time
> From:<A HREF="mailto:Elizabeth Freer">Elizabeth Freer</A>
> To:<A HREF="mailto:gecko@lists.gekkota.com">gecko@lists.gekkota.com</A>
>
>
> Aloha, Sherron, Dennis, & Li'i ~
>
> In my experience Day Geckos (if one can group them all) seem more
> susceptible to stress than my other geckos.
>
> The gaping signals that Li'i is not having fun, now that she has energy to
> tell you so. In this case I don't think it's a breathing thing. It's a
> threat display...so you'd better get away (if you were not trying to help)...ha,
> ha, ha.
>
> What about a smooth padded surface to place Li'i on, maybe like a potholder
> against a table? Press her against the surface gently while Dennis works on
> her tail. Never had to work on a gecko as small as Li'i for extended stuff
> like her tail.
>
> Do you know that Lepidodactylus lugubris are parthenogenetic? They don't
> need males to reproduce. The babies are basically clones of the moms. I have
> seen them arch their backs like cats and have a go at each other kinda
> sideways. Although I hold mine from time to time, and occasionally assist with an
> initial shed just gently, there's not much to hold. I really have not
> purposely kept them on the loose. However, with a large captive population (they
> are like the Energizer Bunny...they keep going and going and going)
> occasionally some get loose. A couple weeks ago I was running the water for my bath
> and all of a sudden one Ll appeared on the top of the faucet. The bad news
> times are when I see one of the moms upsidedown on the screen lid with a
> hatchling in her mouth. Now that's a one way street if I don't catch the situation
> in time.
>
> My favorite geckos for holding (and I do like to hold my geckos) are Oedura
> castelnaui (northern velvet geckos) indigeous to Australia and my tailless
> Rhacodactylus ciliatus (crested gecko) from Melody. The Ocs are nearly 7" long
> from snout to tail tip at maturity. And George (the crested) weighs about
> 50 grams without his tail...a good handful. I wish you could keep these
> geckos in Hawaii. I think you might really like them.
>
> I'm sorry that Sunshine Mealworms could not take you on right now. You
> should be at the top of their list. Have you ever bred mealworms? I think it is
> not that hard. Hopefully Tracy has started a new thread about that.
Sorry I made a mistake. Thought that you had purchased a glass Exo-Terra
12"x 18" tank.
>
> Mahalo,
> Elizabeth
>
>
>
> >> Subj:Re: [gecko]Li'i isn't cooperating!
>> Date:6/8/08 7:22:40 PM Pacific Daylight Time
>> From: gecko.hale@gmail.com (Sherron)
>> Sender: gecko-admin@lists.gekkota.com
>> Reply-to: <A HREF="mailto:gecko@lists.gekkota.com">gecko@lists.gekkota.com</A>
>> To: gecko@lists.gekkota.com
>>
>> Aloha, Melody
>>
>> Thanks for the info on Ed's, I will see if they can ship to me. Or will
>> see if Sunshine will take me with your references. So much appreciated! ;)
>>
>> We are trying to get that tail skin off again and are having so many
>> problems! We thought she was hard to handle before, but now she is a
>> little terror!! She is faster than a speeding bullet -- must be all
>> those fruit flies she is eating! We don't know how to actually hold her
>> down -- we are afraid we will break her, as she is so tiny and she is
>> really fast! She is only holding still for a fraction of a second --
>> she knows the drill now, and all the tricks to get away.
>>
>> Dennis tries to wet her skin and get a grip with the tweezers while I
>> try to keep her from leaping off his lap. But she is a real moving target!
>>
>> And now she is doing something else that has us worried -- she keeps
>> opening her mouth really wild and gaping. She doesn't make any noise so
>> I don't know if she is gasping for air or not, but I don't think we
>> could hear her if she was. I know she hates what we are doing, but we
>> aren't sure if she is really in distress or not. My husband got worried
>> so we put her back in the steam bath to loosen the skin up some more (it
>> moved only a tiny bit), but I wondered if you could shed some light on
>> the gaping.
>>
>> I know some animals, like birds, can actually die from emotional
>> distress, but I don't think geckos fall into that category. Will it hurt
>> her if we continue even though she is showing signs of acute distress?
>> Or could there really be something wrong with her that we just haven't
>> noticed before? I know she was eating today as I saw her catch and eat
>> at least a couple of fruit flies earlier this morning.
>>
>> Or is the little stinker smarter than us and has just gotten us figured
>> out already and knows what buttons to push? ;)
>>
>> Cooston where I grew up wasn't much of a town, either. And we lived
>> about 10 miles outside of it anyway. The closest "big" town to us was
>> North Bend/Coos Bay. I have very fond memories of Oregon, though. It was
>> a great place to grow up, especially for a tomboy like me. I always
>> loved all the animals and the woods ... I had pet frogs, salamanders,
>> timber beetles, snakes, lizards, chickens, crawdads, chipmunks, anything
>> I could get my hands on. I used to drive my poor mom wild. ;)
>>
>> Oh and the berries! There is no place like Oregon for the berries!
>> Salmonberries, huckleberries, thimbleberries, blackberries .. yumm! My
>> best friend and I drove from Southern California up through Oregon to
>> where we lived about 10 years ago and stopped for blackberries along the
>> way every place we spotted them! Great trip! ;)
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Sherron
>>
>> Melody Hartley wrote:
>> > Hi Sharron,
>> >
>> > I get fruit flies from Ed's Fly Meat, http://www.edsflymeatinc.com.
>> > They're near Seattle Washington. (There is no Ed, that's for Erin and
>> > Dave -- nice folks!) If they can't ship to Hawaii they might know of
>> > someone near you who keeps dart frogs and would help. I'd suggest also
>> > getting a bag of their fruit fly medium so you can raise your own. It's
>> > pretty easy, and I can give you some tips if/when you get to that. I
>> > think they sell supplements too, so might have the Rep-Cal. If your
>> > gecko gets UVB from natural direct sunshine (not through a window) you
>> > don't need the kind with D3 in it.
>> >
>> > Elizabeth suggested Sunshine Mealworms, and I agree. They're in
>> > Silverton Oregon. I think they are not taking new mealworm customers
>> > for a while, but you might tell them that Elizabeth and I recommended
>> > them and maybe that will make a difference ;-)
>> >
>> > You mentioned that you thought the old skin on Li'i's tail is getting
>> > tighter. She is probably just growing on your hand-fed gourmet diet!
>> > Geckos store fat in their tails. An idea on removing the skin: See if
>> > you can get it to split by using 2 pairs of tweezers and gently pulling
>> > on the edge closest to her body. This probably would need a second
>> > person holding the gecko.
>> >
>> > Aloha is about 10 miles west of Portland, between Beaverton and
>> > Hillsboro. It's not exactly a town -- everything runs together here now
>> > and it never was much of a town. But I like the name too ;-D
>> >
>> > My geckos would love some of those big fruit flies! I'm sure you can't
>> > ship them to Oregon though, LOL!
>> >
>> > Best of luck!
>> > Melody
>> >
>> > Gecko wrote:
>> >> Aloha, Melody
>> >>
>> >> Flightless fruit flies!! Wouldn't she like that!! I will have to
>> >> google for them and see if I can get them into Hawaii! I have to
>> >> have an import license to have mealworms shipped to me to feed the
>> >> geckos! Right now, we are having problems finding someone to ship
>> >> quickly enough in the summer, even with the license. We need a good
>> >> supplier that ships from somewhere near the west coast as all the
>> >> places I know are mid or east coast. A mealworm import license is $50
>> >> a year for unlimited shipments -- and they all go through Honolulu
>> >> for inspection! If flightless fruit flies are on the list, they would
>> >> cost the same. Hawaii actually has a great endemic fruit fly that is
>> >> huge -- about the size of a small house fly. Too big for our little
>> >> Preemie girl as it is almost the size of her head! Pretty neat, though!
>> >>
>> >> Yes, I would be interested in your source for the flies. I can always
>> >> ask them if they ship here. We did find a small scissors on a Swiss
>> >> army knife, so my job has become easier and faster, thank goodness!
>> >> I can sometimes now just hold them with my fingers and clip them!
>> >> Much easier! ;)
>> >>
>> >> We are watching the tail skin. I worry that it is too tight on her.
>> >> And it seems to make her tail less flexible. But we dread trying to
>> >> get it off, as she really seems unhappy when we try to work on her
>> >> tail. Not that she liked the rest of it, but that part always
>> >> bothered her the most and she would take off like a bolt!!
>> >>
>> >> Hey, I am a webfoot as I was born in Oregon in Myrtle Point! We moved
>> >> away to England for a year when I was 11, 'though, so I am not real
>> >> familiar with where places are. I have not heard of Aloha in Oregon,
>> >> but I sure like the name! ;)
>> >>
>> >> Mahalo,
>> >> Sherron
>> >>
>> >> Melody Hartley wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Aloha Sharron,
>> >>>
>> >>> You are so patient and dedicated!! This little one is so lucky to
>> >>> have you, since I'm sure she would have been someone's lunch
>> >>> otherwise. If she goes on eating fruit flies, you know you can
>> >>> raise flightess fruit flies, and that might be easier. I do that
>> >>> because I keep a few dart frogs, but I use them for hatchling geckos
>> >>> too. You'd have to get a starter culture from someone, or get one
>> >>> shipped to you if allowed, and keep them strictly separate from the
>> >>> flying ones because "flightless" is a recessive gene. I can give
>> >>> you more info if you're interested.
>> >>>
>> >>> Do you have the little bugs in the soil called springtails? Or any
>> >>> other tiny bugs you could catch, maybe aphids? I'd hate for you go
>> >>> blind clipping fruit fly wings, LOL!
>> >>>
>> >>> As to the last bits of shedding, she might lose the extra skin on
>> >>> the next shed. I've only gotten the tail skin off by peeling front
>> >>> to back, like turning a cone inside out.
>> >>>
>> >>> The town in Oregon that I live in is named "Aloha" although
>> >>> pronounced differently -- emphasis on the "lo" part and a soft "h"
>> >>> -- ah-LO-ah.
>> >>>
>> >>> It's also nice to see some activity on this list ;-)
>> >>>
>> >>> Melody
>> >>>
>> >>> Gecko wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Aloha, Melody
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Thanks for these ideas. I never thought of a paintbrush, but that
>> >>>> would be softer and probably hold the moisture better. ;)
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Her toes kept sticking to the washcloth, so we did lay a paper
>> >>>> towel on top of it and she liked that better.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Now that she is back in her regular house, she is on banana leaf
>> >>>> with red ti, honeysuckle, and helekonia. We used to have her on
>> >>>> paper towels, but she really seems to like the banana leaf and we
>> >>>> have tons of them. And the red ti is her favorite for hanging out
>> >>>> on. And all the day geckos like the helekonia -- that and the
>> >>>> bananas are their favorite hangouts ... along with our lanai and
>> >>>> house. ;)
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Mahalo,
>> >>>> Sherron
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Melody Hartley wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> Slightly different method -- I use a paper towel rather than a
>> >>>>> washcloth in the humid box, and float the whole box in a sink full
>> >>>>> of warm water for the heat. A small soft paintbrush can also be
>> >>>>> helpful for wetting the old skin and working it loose.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> elizabethfreer@aol.com wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>> And Aloha Sherron ~
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Thanks for these details. Please try the humidity chamber near a
>> >>>>>> lamp for a few hours. Use a wet washcloth that has been wrung
>> >>>>>> out and place it in the vented, plastic container. Watch the
>> >>>>>> water droplets form. After only a few hours I imagine her skin
>> >>>>>> might be loose enough to start a split.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Another idea! Have something like a twig, small branch, or a
>> >>>>>> section of choya wood --- something rough that she could snuggle
>> >>>>>> up against to assist in the shed.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I hope the skin shed helps her right leg work more efficiently!
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Keep us posted!
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Wish I lived near the beach in a place warm enough where geckos
>> >>>>>> roamed freely ;-]
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Elizabeth
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Aloha, Elizabeth
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> She is about 3/4" from nose to vent -- she is the smallest
>> >>>>>> day gecko
>> >>>>>> hatchling we have ever seen, although some of our mourning gecko
>> >>>>>> hatchlings are even tinier.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> This sounds like it might work! If it would just soften
>> >>>>>> enough to
>> >>>>>> pull off her or get a split started, I think we could get the
>> >>>>>> neck
>> >>>>>> skin off. We have been misting her little cage and putting a
>> >>>>>> heating pad next to it, but that only helps a little and wasn't
>> >>>>>> keeping the humidity up high enough.
>> >>>>>> She has never seemed to be able to fully control her right
>> >>>>>> leg, and
>> >>>>>> her right foot is smaller than her left and the toes kind of
>> >>>>>> clumped
>> >>>>>> together. She often tends to move the joint and leg together
>> >>>>>> as a
>> >>>>>> unit, so there may be something wrong with the joint, too.
>> >>>>>> Although
>> >>>>>> in watching her with the skin problem, some of that may just
>> >>>>>> be the
>> >>>>>> skin being so tight it restricts her movement.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Usually when we find the hatchlings, most of that first skin has
>> >>>>>> already been shed, but she was fully covered with it and it
>> >>>>>> has only
>> >>>>>> recently started splitting. We do think it hinders her use of
>> >>>>>> her
>> >>>>>> limbs -- her arms are only about the size of thin pencil
>> >>>>>> lead, and
>> >>>>>> the skin seems to fully coat those.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> She has been doing okay up until the last couple of days,
>> >>>>>> though,
>> >>>>>> when the skin (I hope that it isn't something else, too) started
>> >>>>>> really becoming a problem. She now gets around by lurching
>> >>>>>> her body
>> >>>>>> back and forth because her little arms & legs are still
>> >>>>>> encased in
>> >>>>>> the skin, although it has come off some of the back. And she is
>> >>>>>> green underneath, not gray!
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> We haven't ever actually kept any of the geckos before, as
>> >>>>>> they run
>> >>>>>> all around our house, lanai and garden (Phelsuma laticauda,
>> >>>>>> house -
>> >>>>>> Hemidactylus frenatus, & Mourning - Lepidodactylus lugubris).
>> >>>>>> But we
>> >>>>>> had to make an exception in her case, since she couldn't fend
>> >>>>>> for
>> >>>>>> herself. Usually we just take the hatchlings outside so they
>> >>>>>> have a
>> >>>>>> better chance of survival -- we have lots of big geckos running
>> >>>>>> around inside and they don't last long if we don't get to
>> >>>>>> them first. :(
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Mahalo, Sherron
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> ElizabethFreer@aol.com wrote:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Hello Sherron ~
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Try the humidity chamber trick. I can't view your photos at
>> >>>>>>> home
>> >>>>>>> because my laptop is really memory-challenged, so I don't
>> >>>>>>> know how
>> >>>>>>> big this gecko is! However, my mourning geckos are 1" 3/8" at
>> >>>>>>> hatching. Try placing your gecko in a vented plastic container
>> >>>>>>> with a damp washcloth inside. Place this near a light. Almost
>> >>>>>>> immediately you will notice beads of water accumulate on the
>> >>>>>>> sides/top of the container. After a few hours or so perhaps
>> >>>>>>> you
>> >>>>>>> can remove the rings of old skin around her neck gently with a
>> >>>>>>> tweezers or small scissors.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> What is the problem with her right leg? Might you have a
>> >>>>>>> new pet
>> >>>>>>> here?
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Elizabeth
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> Subj:[gecko]Question on hatchling Gold Dust Day Gecko having
>> >>>>>>>> trouble shedding "egg skin"
>> >>>>>>>> Date:6/1/08 4:16:39 PM Pacific Daylight Time
>> >>>>>>>> From: gecko.hale@gmail.com (Sherron)
>> >>>>>>>> Sender: gecko-admin@lists.gekkota.com
>> >>>>>>>> Reply-to: gecko@lists.gekkota.com
>> >>>>>>>> <mailto:gecko@lists.gekkota.com>
>> >>>>>>>> To: gecko@lists.gekkota.com
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> We found a tiny hatchling on May 13 that was a little
>> >>>>>>> underdeveloped and was still in that grayish skin they have
>> >>>>>>> when
>> >>>>>>> they first come out of the shell. She was dehydrated and has a
>> >>>>>>> problem with her right leg, but is spunky.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> We haven't been able to release her outside like we do the
>> >>>>>>> rest of
>> >>>>>>> the hatchings we find, as her bad leg has kept her from
>> >>>>>>> being very
>> >>>>>>> mobile, but she has been doing pretty well eating tiny bugs &
>> >>>>>>> aphids I collect for her. She has also shown a real interest in
>> >>>>>>> the fruit flies around her papaya, but I don't think she has
>> >>>>>>> managed to catch any yet.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> But she started having trouble yesterday and was real cold &
>> >>>>>>> clammy, so we put a heating pad near her cage to help warm
>> >>>>>>> her up.
>> >>>>>>> It seems to have started her molting her "egg skin", but she
>> >>>>>>> has a
>> >>>>>>> bunch of it around her neck that she can't get off.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Is there anything we can do to help her? She is so tiny we
>> >>>>>>> don't
>> >>>>>>> see how we could try to cut it off! The rest of the skin except
>> >>>>>>> for around her neck should slough off okay, but the stuff
>> >>>>>>> around
>> >>>>>>> her neck is several layers and is a ring, so it may be another
>> >>>>>>> matter. :(
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Any help would be greatly appreciated as she is really a spunky
>> >>>>>>> little girl.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Mahalo, Sherron
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>> >>>>>> From: Gecko <gecko.hale@gmail.com>
>> >>>>>> To: gecko@lists.gekkota.com
>> >>>>>> Sent: Mon, 2 Jun 2008 11:21 am
>> >>>>>> Subject: Re: [gecko]Question on hatchling Gold Dust Day Gecko
>> >>>>>> having trouble shedding ...
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Aloha, Elizabeth
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> She is about 3/4" from nose to vent -- she is the smallest day
>> >>>>>> gecko hatchling we have ever seen, although some of our mourning
>> >>>>>> gecko hatchlings are even tinier.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> This sounds like it might work! If it would just soften enough
>> >>>>>> to pull off her or get a split started, I think we could get the
>> >>>>>> neck skin off. We have been misting her little cage and putting
>> >>>>>> a heating pad next to it, but that only helps a little and wasn't
>> >>>>>> keeping the humidity up high enough.
>> >>>>>> She has never seemed to be able to fully control her right leg,
>> >>>>>> and her right foot is smaller than her left and the toes kind of
>> >>>>>> clumped together. She often tends to move the joint and leg
>> >>>>>> together as a unit, so there may be something wrong with the
>> >>>>>> joint, too. Although in watching her with the skin problem, some
>> >>>>>> of that may just be the skin being so tight it restricts her
>> >>>>>> movement.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Usually when we find the hatchlings, most of that first skin has
>> >>>>>> already been shed, but she was fully covered with it and it has
>> >>>>>> only recently started splitting. We do think it hinders her use
>> >>>>>> of her limbs -- her arms are only about the size of thin pencil
>> >>>>>> lead, and the skin seems to fully coat those.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> She has been doing okay up until the last couple of days, though,
>> >>>>>> when the skin (I hope that it isn't something else, too) started
>> >>>>>> really becoming a problem. She now gets around by lurching her
>> >>>>>> body back and forth because her little arms & legs are still
>> >>>>>> encased in the skin, although it has come off some of the back.
>> >>>>>> And she is green underneath, not gray!
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> We haven't ever actually kept any of the geckos before, as they
>> >>>>>> run all around our house, lanai and garden (Phelsuma laticauda,
>> >>>>>> house - Hemidactylus frenatus, & Mourning - Lepidodactylus
>> >>>>>> lugubris). But we had to make an exception in her case, since she
>> >>>>>> couldn't fend for herself. Usually we just take the hatchlings
>> >>>>>> outside so they have a better chance of survival -- we have lots
>> >>>>>> of big geckos running around inside and they don't last long if
>> >>>>>> we don't get to them first. :(
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Mahalo, Sherron
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> ElizabethFreer@aol.com wrote:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Hello Sherron ~
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Try the humidity chamber trick. I can't view your photos at
>> >>>>>>> home because my laptop is really memory-challenged, so I don't
>> >>>>>>> know how big this gecko is! However, my mourning geckos are 1"
>> >>>>>>> 3/8" at hatching. Try placing your gecko in a vented plastic
>> >>>>>>> container with a damp washcloth inside. Place this near a
>> >>>>>>> light. Almost immediately you will notice beads of water
>> >>>>>>> accumulate on the sides/top of the container. After a few hours
>> >>>>>>> or so perhaps you can remove the rings of old skin around her
>> >>>>>>> neck gently with a tweezers or small scissors.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> What is the problem with her right leg? Might you have a new
>> >>>>>>> pet here?
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Elizabeth
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> Subj:[gecko]Question on hatchling Gold Dust Day Gecko having
>> >>>>>>>> trouble shedding "egg skin"
>> >>>>>>>> Date:6/1/08 4:16:39 PM Pacific Daylight Time
>> >>>>>>>> From: gecko.hale@gmail.com (Sherron)
>> >>>>>>>> Sender: gecko-admin@lists.gekkota.com
>> >>>>>>>> Reply-to: gecko@lists.gekkota.com <mailto:gecko@lists.gekkota.com>
>> >>>>>>>> To: gecko@lists.gekkota.com
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> We found a tiny hatchling on May 13 that was a little
>> >>>>>>> underdeveloped and was still in that grayish skin they have when
>> >>>>>>> they first come out of the shell. She was dehydrated and has a
>> >>>>>>> problem with her right leg, but is spunky.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> We haven't been able to release her outside like we do the rest
>> >>>>>>> of the hatchings we find, as her bad leg has kept her from being
>> >>>>>>> very mobile, but she has been doing pretty well eating tiny bugs
>> >>>>>>> & aphids I collect for her. She has also shown a real interest
>> >>>>>>> in the fruit flies around her papaya, but I don't think she has
>> >>>>>>> managed to catch any yet.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> But she started having trouble yesterday and was real cold &
>> >>>>>>> clammy, so we put a heating pad near her cage to help warm her
>> >>>>>>> up. It seems to have started her molting her "egg skin", but she
>> >>>>>>> has a bunch of it around her neck that she can't get off.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Is there anything we can do to help her? She is so tiny we don't
>> >>>>>>> see how we could try to cut it off! The rest of the skin except
>> >>>>>>> for around her neck should slough off okay, but the stuff around
>> >>>>>>> her neck is several layers and is a ring, so it may be another
>> >>>>>>> matter. :(
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Any help would be greatly appreciated as she is really a spunky
>> >>>>>>> little girl.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>
>
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<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-=
LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Subj:<B>Re: [gecko]Li'i isn=
't cooperating!</B>
<BR>Date:6/8/08 9:37:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time
<BR>From:<A HREF=3D"mailto:Elizabeth Freer">Elizabeth Freer</A></FONT><FONT=20=
COLOR=3D"#804000" BACK=3D"#ffffff" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=
=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">
<BR>To:<A HREF=3D"mailto:gecko@lists.gekkota.com">gecko@lists.gekkota.com</A=
></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#804000" BACK=3D"#ffffff" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR:=
#ffffff" SIZE=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0=
">
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" BACK=3D"#ffffff" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COL=
OR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=
=3D"0">
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#804000" BACK=3D"#ffffff" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COL=
OR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SCRIPT" FACE=3D"Comic Sans MS" L=
ANG=3D"0">Aloha, Sherron, Dennis, & Li'i ~
<BR>
<BR>In my experience Day Geckos (if one can group them all) seem more suscep=
tible to stress than my other geckos.
<BR>
<BR>The gaping signals that Li'i is <B>not</B> having fun, now that she has=20=
energy to tell you so. In this case I don't think it's a breathing thi=
ng. It's a threat display...so you'd better get away (if you were not=20=
trying to help)...ha, ha, ha.
<BR>
<BR><B>What about a smooth padded surface to place Li'i on, maybe like a pot=
holder against a table? Press her against the surface gently while Den=
nis works on her tail.</B> Never had to work on a gecko as small as Li=
'i for extended stuff like her tail.
<BR>
<BR>Do you know that Lepidodactylus lugubris are parthenogenetic? They=
don't need males to reproduce. The babies are basically clones of the=
moms. I have seen them arch their backs like cats and have a go at ea=
ch other kinda sideways. Although I hold mine from time to time, and o=
ccasionally assist with an initial shed just gently, there's not much to hol=
d. I really have not purposely kept them on the loose. However,=20=
with a large captive population (they are like the Energizer Bunny...they ke=
ep going and going and going) occasionally some get loose. A couple we=
eks ago I was running the water for my bath and all of a sudden one Ll appea=
red on the top of the faucet. The bad news times are when I see one of=
the moms upsidedown on the screen lid with a hatchling in her mouth. =
Now that's a one way street if I don't catch the situation in time.
<BR>
<BR>My favorite geckos for holding (and I do like to hold my geckos) are Oed=
ura castelnaui (northern velvet geckos) indigeous to Australia and my taille=
ss Rhacodactylus ciliatus (crested gecko) from Melody. The Ocs are nea=
rly 7" long from snout to tail tip at maturity. And George (the creste=
d) weighs about 50 grams without his tail...a good handful. I wish you=
could keep these geckos in Hawaii. I think you might really like them=
.
<BR>
<BR>I'm sorry that Sunshine Mealworms could not take you on right now.  =
;You <B><I>should</B></I> be at the top of their list. Have you ever b=
red mealworms? I think it is not that hard. Hopefully Tracy has=20=
started a new thread about that.</FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#804000" BACK=3D"#fff=
fff" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D3 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SCRI=
PT" FACE=3D"Comic Sans MS" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#804000" BACK=3D"#ffffff" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COL=
OR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SCRIPT" FACE=3D"Comic Sans MS" L=
ANG=3D"0">Sorry I made a mistake. Thought that you had purchased a gla=
ss Exo-Terra 12"x 18" tank.
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#804000" BACK=3D"#ffffff" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COL=
OR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D3 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SCRIPT" FACE=3D"Comic Sans MS" L=
ANG=3D"0">
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#804000" BACK=3D"#ffffff" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COL=
OR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SCRIPT" FACE=3D"Comic Sans MS" L=
ANG=3D"0"><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; M=
ARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">
<BR>Mahalo,
<BR>Elizabeth
<BR>
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" BACK=3D"#ffffff" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COL=
OR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=
=3D"0">
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-=
LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Subj:<B>Re: [gecko]Li'i isn=
't cooperating!</B>
<BR>Date:6/8/08 7:22:40 PM Pacific Daylight Time
<BR>From: gecko.hale@gmail.com (Sherron)
<BR>Sender: gecko-admin@lists.gekkota.com
<BR>Reply-to: <A HREF=3D"mailto:gecko@lists.gekkota.com">gecko@lists.gekkota=
.com</A></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#804000" BACK=3D"#ffffff" style=3D"BACKGROUND=
-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" LA=
NG=3D"0">
<BR>To: gecko@lists.gekkota.com
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" BACK=3D"#ffffff" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COL=
OR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=
=3D"0">
<BR>Aloha, Melody
<BR>
<BR>Thanks for the info on Ed's, I will see if they can ship to me. Or will=20
<BR>see if Sunshine will take me with your references. So much appreciated!=20=
;)
<BR>
<BR>We are trying to get that tail skin off again and are having so many=20
<BR>problems! We thought she was hard to handle before, but now she is a=20
<BR>little terror!! She is faster than a speeding bullet -- must be all=20
<BR>those fruit flies she is eating! We don't know how to actually hold her=20
<BR>down -- we are afraid we will break her, as she is so tiny and she is=20
<BR>really fast! She is only holding still for a fraction of a second=20=
--=20
<BR>she knows the drill now, and all the tricks to get away.
<BR>
<BR>Dennis tries to wet her skin and get a grip with the tweezers while I=20
<BR>try to keep her from leaping off his lap. But she is a real moving targe=
t!
<BR>
<BR>And now she is doing something else that has us worried -- she keeps=20
<BR>opening her mouth really wild and gaping. She doesn't make any noise so=20
<BR>I don't know if she is gasping for air or not, but I don't think we=20
<BR>could hear her if she was. I know she hates what we are doing, but we=20
<BR>aren't sure if she is really in distress or not. My husband got worried=20
<BR>so we put her back in the steam bath to loosen the skin up some more (it=
=20
<BR>moved only a tiny bit), but I wondered if you could shed some light on=20
<BR>the gaping.=20
<BR>
<BR>I know some animals, like birds, can actually die from emotional=20
<BR>distress, but I don't think geckos fall into that category. Will it hurt=
=20
<BR>her if we continue even though she is showing signs of acute distress?=20
<BR>Or could there really be something wrong with her that we just haven't=20
<BR>noticed before? I know she was eating today as I saw her catch and=
eat=20
<BR>at least a couple of fruit flies earlier this morning.
<BR>
<BR>Or is the little stinker smarter than us and has just gotten us figured=20
<BR>out already and knows what buttons to push? ;)
<BR>
<BR>Cooston where I grew up wasn't much of a town, either. And we lived=20
<BR>about 10 miles outside of it anyway. The closest "big" town to us was=20
<BR>North Bend/Coos Bay. I have very fond memories of Oregon, though. It was=
=20
<BR>a great place to grow up, especially for a tomboy like me. I always=20
<BR>loved all the animals and the woods ... I had pet frogs, salamanders,=20
<BR>timber beetles, snakes, lizards, chickens, crawdads, chipmunks, anything=
=20
<BR>I could get my hands on. I used to drive my poor mom wild. ;)
<BR>
<BR>Oh and the berries! There is no place like Oregon for the berries!=20
<BR>Salmonberries, huckleberries, thimbleberries, blackberries .. yumm! My=20
<BR>best friend and I drove from Southern California up through Oregon to=20
<BR>where we lived about 10 years ago and stopped for blackberries along the=
=20
<BR>way every place we spotted them! Great trip! ;)
<BR>
<BR>Thanks,
<BR>Sherron
<BR>
<BR>Melody Hartley wrote:
<BR>> Hi Sharron,
<BR>>
<BR>> I get fruit flies from Ed's Fly Meat, http://www.edsflymeatinc.com.
<BR>> They're near Seattle Washington. (There is no Ed, that's for Erin a=
nd
<BR>> Dave -- nice folks!) If they can't ship to Hawaii they might know o=
f
<BR>> someone near you who keeps dart frogs and would help. I'd sug=
gest also
<BR>> getting a bag of their fruit fly medium so you can raise your own.=20=
It's
<BR>> pretty easy, and I can give you some tips if/when you get to that.=20=
I
<BR>> think they sell supplements too, so might have the Rep-Cal. I=
f your
<BR>> gecko gets UVB from natural direct sunshine (not through a window)=20=
you
<BR>> don't need the kind with D3 in it.
<BR>>
<BR>> Elizabeth suggested Sunshine Mealworms, and I agree. They're=20=
in
<BR>> Silverton Oregon. I think they are not taking new mealworm cu=
stomers
<BR>> for a while, but you might tell them that Elizabeth and I recommend=
ed
<BR>> them and maybe that will make a difference ;-)
<BR>>
<BR>> You mentioned that you thought the old skin on Li'i's tail is getti=
ng
<BR>> tighter. She is probably just growing on your hand-fed gourmet diet=
!
<BR>> Geckos store fat in their tails. An idea on removing the skin=
: See if
<BR>> you can get it to split by using 2 pairs of tweezers and gently pul=
ling
<BR>> on the edge closest to her body. This probably would need a s=
econd
<BR>> person holding the gecko.
<BR>>
<BR>> Aloha is about 10 miles west of Portland, between Beaverton and
<BR>> Hillsboro. It's not exactly a town -- everything runs togethe=
r here now
<BR>> and it never was much of a town. But I like the name too ;-D
<BR>>
<BR>> My geckos would love some of those big fruit flies! I'm sure=20=
you can't
<BR>> ship them to Oregon though, LOL!
<BR>>
<BR>> Best of luck!
<BR>> Melody
<BR>>
<BR>> Gecko wrote:
<BR>>> Aloha, Melody
<BR>>>
<BR>>> Flightless fruit flies!! Wouldn't she like that!! I will=20=
have to=20
<BR>>> google for them and see if I can get them into Hawaii! I=20=
have to=20
<BR>>> have an import license to have mealworms shipped to me to feed=20=
the=20
<BR>>> geckos! Right now, we are having problems finding someone to sh=
ip=20
<BR>>> quickly enough in the summer, even with the license. We need a=20=
good=20
<BR>>> supplier that ships from somewhere near the west coast as all t=
he=20
<BR>>> places I know are mid or east coast. A mealworm import license=20=
is $50=20
<BR>>> a year for unlimited shipments -- and they all go through Honol=
ulu=20
<BR>>> for inspection! If flightless fruit flies are on the list, they=
would=20
<BR>>> cost the same. Hawaii actually has a great endemic fruit fly th=
at is=20
<BR>>> huge -- about the size of a small house fly. Too big for our li=
ttle=20
<BR>>> Preemie girl as it is almost the size of her head! Pretty neat,=
though!
<BR>>>
<BR>>> Yes, I would be interested in your source for the flies. I can=20=
always=20
<BR>>> ask them if they ship here. We did find a small scissors on a S=
wiss=20
<BR>>> army knife, so my job has become easier and faster, thank=
goodness!=20
<BR>>> I can sometimes now just hold them with my fingers and clip the=
m!=20
<BR>>> Much easier! ;)
<BR>>>
<BR>>> We are watching the tail skin. I worry that it is too tight on=20=
her.=20
<BR>>> And it seems to make her tail less flexible. But we dread tryin=
g to=20
<BR>>> get it off, as she really seems unhappy when we try to work on=20=
her=20
<BR>>> tail. Not that she liked the rest of it, but that part always=20
<BR>>> bothered her the most and she would take off like a bolt!!
<BR>>>
<BR>>> Hey, I am a webfoot as I was born in Oregon in Myrtle Point! We=
moved=20
<BR>>> away to England for a year when I was 11, 'though, so I am not=20=
real=20
<BR>>> familiar with where places are. I have not heard of Aloha in Or=
egon,=20
<BR>>> but I sure like the name! ;)
<BR>>>
<BR>>> Mahalo,
<BR>>> Sherron
<BR>>>
<BR>>> Melody Hartley wrote:
<BR>>>
<BR>>>> Aloha Sharron,
<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> You are so patient and dedicated!! This little one is=
so lucky to=20
<BR>>>> have you, since I'm sure she would have been someone's lunc=
h=20
<BR>>>> otherwise. If she goes on eating fruit flies, you kno=
w you can=20
<BR>>>> raise flightess fruit flies, and that might be easier. &nbs=
p;I do that=20
<BR>>>> because I keep a few dart frogs, but I use them for hatchli=
ng geckos=20
<BR>>>> too. You'd have to get a starter culture from someone=
, or get one=20
<BR>>>> shipped to you if allowed, and keep them strictly separate=20=
from the=20
<BR>>>> flying ones because "flightless" is a recessive gene.  =
;I can give=20
<BR>>>> you more info if you're interested.
<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> Do you have the little bugs in the soil called springtails?=
Or any=20
<BR>>>> other tiny bugs you could catch, maybe aphids? I'd ha=
te for you go=20
<BR>>>> blind clipping fruit fly wings, LOL!
<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> As to the last bits of shedding, she might lose the extra s=
kin on=20
<BR>>>> the next shed. I've only gotten the tail skin off by=20=
peeling front=20
<BR>>>> to back, like turning a cone inside out.
<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> The town in Oregon that I live in is named "Aloha" although=
=20
<BR>>>> pronounced differently -- emphasis on the "lo" part and a s=
oft "h"=20
<BR>>>> -- ah-LO-ah.
<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> It's also nice to see some activity on this list ;-)
<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> Melody
<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> Gecko wrote:
<BR>>>>
<BR>>>>> Aloha, Melody
<BR>>>>>
<BR>>>>> Thanks for these ideas. I never thought of a paintbrush=
, but that=20
<BR>>>>> would be softer and probably hold the moisture better.=20=
;)
<BR>>>>>
<BR>>>>> Her toes kept sticking to the washcloth, so we did lay=20=
a paper=20
<BR>>>>> towel on top of it and she liked that better.
<BR>>>>>
<BR>>>>> Now that she is back in her regular house, she is on ba=
nana leaf=20
<BR>>>>> with red ti, honeysuckle, and helekonia. We used to hav=
e her on=20
<BR>>>>> paper towels, but she really seems to like the banana l=
eaf and we=20
<BR>>>>> have tons of them. And the red ti is her favorite for h=
anging out=20
<BR>>>>> on. And all the day geckos like the helekonia -- that a=
nd the=20
<BR>>>>> bananas are their favorite hangouts ... along with our=20=
lanai and=20
<BR>>>>> house. ;)
<BR>>>>>
<BR>>>>> Mahalo,
<BR>>>>> Sherron
<BR>>>>>
<BR>>>>>
<BR>>>>>
<BR>>>>> Melody Hartley wrote:
<BR>>>>>
<BR>>>>>> Slightly different method -- I use a paper towel ra=
ther than a=20
<BR>>>>>> washcloth in the humid box, and float the whole box=
in a sink full=20
<BR>>>>>> of warm water for the heat. A small soft pain=
tbrush can also be=20
<BR>>>>>> helpful for wetting the old skin and working it loo=
se.
<BR>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>> elizabethfreer@aol.com wrote:
<BR>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> And Aloha Sherron ~
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Thanks for these details. Please try the=20=
humidity chamber near a=20
<BR>>>>>>> lamp for a few hours. Use a wet washcloth=
that has been wrung=20
<BR>>>>>>> out and place it in the vented, plastic contain=
er. Watch the=20
<BR>>>>>>> water droplets form. After only a few hou=
rs I imagine her skin=20
<BR>>>>>>> might be loose enough to start a split.
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Another idea! Have something like a twig,=
small branch, or a=20
<BR>>>>>>> section of choya wood --- something rough that=20=
she could snuggle=20
<BR>>>>>>> up against to assist in the shed.
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> I hope the skin shed helps her right leg work m=
ore efficiently!
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Keep us posted!
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Wish I lived near the beach in a place warm eno=
ugh where geckos=20
<BR>>>>>>> roamed freely ;-]
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Elizabeth
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Aloha, Elizabeth
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> She is about 3/4" from=20=
nose to vent -- she is the smallest=20
<BR>>>>>>> day gecko
<BR>>>>>>> hatchling we have ever=20=
seen, although some of our mourning gecko
<BR>>>>>>> hatchlings are even tin=
ier.
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> This sounds like it mig=
ht work! If it would just soften=20
<BR>>>>>>> enough to
<BR>>>>>>> pull off her or get a s=
plit started, I think we could get the=20
<BR>>>>>>> neck
<BR>>>>>>> skin off. We have=
been misting her little cage and putting a
<BR>>>>>>> heating pad next to it,=
but that only helps a little and wasn't
<BR>>>>>>> keeping the humidity up=
high enough.
<BR>>>>>>> She has never seemed to=
be able to fully control her right=20
<BR>>>>>>> leg, and
<BR>>>>>>> her right foot is small=
er than her left and the toes kind of=20
<BR>>>>>>> clumped
<BR>>>>>>> together. She often ten=
ds to move the joint and leg together=20
<BR>>>>>>> as a
<BR>>>>>>> unit, so there may be s=
omething wrong with the joint, too.=20
<BR>>>>>>> Although
<BR>>>>>>> in watching her with th=
e skin problem, some of that may just=20
<BR>>>>>>> be the
<BR>>>>>>> skin being so tight it=20=
restricts her movement.
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Usually when we find th=
e hatchlings, most of that first skin has
<BR>>>>>>> already been shed, but=20=
she was fully covered with it and it=20
<BR>>>>>>> has only
<BR>>>>>>> recently started splitt=
ing. We do think it hinders her use of=20
<BR>>>>>>> her
<BR>>>>>>> limbs -- her arms are o=
nly about the size of thin pencil=20
<BR>>>>>>> lead, and
<BR>>>>>>> the skin seems to fully=
coat those.
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> She has been doing okay=
up until the last couple of days,=20
<BR>>>>>>> though,
<BR>>>>>>> when the skin (I hope t=
hat it isn't something else, too) started
<BR>>>>>>> really becoming a probl=
em. She now gets around by lurching=20
<BR>>>>>>> her body
<BR>>>>>>> back and forth because=20=
her little arms & legs are still=20
<BR>>>>>>> encased in
<BR>>>>>>> the skin, although it h=
as come off some of the back. And she is
<BR>>>>>>> green underneath, not g=
ray!
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> We haven't ever actuall=
y kept any of the geckos before, as=20
<BR>>>>>>> they run
<BR>>>>>>> all around our house, l=
anai and garden (Phelsuma laticauda,=20
<BR>>>>>>> house -
<BR>>>>>>> Hemidactylus frenatus,=20=
& Mourning - Lepidodactylus lugubris).=20
<BR>>>>>>> But we
<BR>>>>>>> had to make an exceptio=
n in her case, since she couldn't fend=20
<BR>>>>>>> for
<BR>>>>>>> herself. Usually we jus=
t take the hatchlings outside so they=20
<BR>>>>>>> have a
<BR>>>>>>> better chance of surviv=
al -- we have lots of big geckos running
<BR>>>>>>> around inside and they=20=
don't last long if we don't get to=20
<BR>>>>>>> them first. :(
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Mahalo, Sherron
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> ElizabethFreer@aol.com=20=
wrote:
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Hello Sherron ~
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Try the humidity ch=
amber trick. I can't view your photos at=20
<BR>>>>>>>> home
<BR>>>>>>>> because my laptop i=
s really memory-challenged, so I don't=20
<BR>>>>>>>> know how
<BR>>>>>>>> big this gecko is!=20=
However, my mourning geckos are 1" 3/8" at
<BR>>>>>>>> hatching. Try=
placing your gecko in a vented plastic container
<BR>>>>>>>> with a damp washclo=
th inside. Place this near a light. Almost
<BR>>>>>>>> immediately you wil=
l notice beads of water accumulate on the
<BR>>>>>>>> sides/top of the co=
ntainer. After a few hours or so perhaps=20
<BR>>>>>>>> you
<BR>>>>>>>> can remove the ring=
s of old skin around her neck gently with a
<BR>>>>>>>> tweezers or small s=
cissors.
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> What is the problem=
with her right leg? Might you have a=20
<BR>>>>>>>> new pet
<BR>>>>>>>> here?
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Elizabeth
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>>> Subj:[gecko]Que=
stion on hatchling Gold Dust Day Gecko having
<BR>>>>>>>>> trouble sheddin=
g "egg skin"
<BR>>>>>>>>> Date:6/1/08 4:1=
6:39 PM Pacific Daylight Time
<BR>>>>>>>>> From: &nb=
sp; gecko.hale@gmail.com (Sherron)
<BR>>>>>>>>> Sender: &=
nbsp; gecko-admin@lists.gekkota.com
<BR>>>>>>>>> Reply-to: gecko=
@lists.gekkota.com=20
<BR>>>>>>>>> <mailto:gecko@lists.gekkota.com>
<BR>>>>>>>>> To:  =
; gecko@lists.gekkota.com
<BR>>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> We found a tiny hat=
chling on May 13 that was a little
<BR>>>>>>>> underdeveloped and=20=
was still in that grayish skin they have=20
<BR>>>>>>>> when
<BR>>>>>>>> they first come out=
of the shell. She was dehydrated and has a
<BR>>>>>>>> problem with her ri=
ght leg, but is spunky.
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> We haven't been abl=
e to release her outside like we do the=20
<BR>>>>>>>> rest of
<BR>>>>>>>> the hatchings we fi=
nd, as her bad leg has kept her from=20
<BR>>>>>>>> being very
<BR>>>>>>>> mobile, but she has=
been doing pretty well eating tiny bugs &
<BR>>>>>>>> aphids I collect fo=
r her. She has also shown a real interest in
<BR>>>>>>>> the fruit flies aro=
und her papaya, but I don't think she has
<BR>>>>>>>> managed to catch an=
y yet.
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> But she started hav=
ing trouble yesterday and was real cold &
<BR>>>>>>>> clammy, so we put a=
heating pad near her cage to help warm=20
<BR>>>>>>>> her up.
<BR>>>>>>>> It seems to have st=
arted her molting her "egg skin", but she=20
<BR>>>>>>>> has a
<BR>>>>>>>> bunch of it around=20=
her neck that she can't get off.
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Is there anything w=
e can do to help her? She is so tiny we=20
<BR>>>>>>>> don't
<BR>>>>>>>> see how we could tr=
y to cut it off! The rest of the skin except
<BR>>>>>>>> for around her neck=
should slough off okay, but the stuff=20
<BR>>>>>>>> around
<BR>>>>>>>> her neck is several=
layers and is a ring, so it may be another
<BR>>>>>>>> matter. :(
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Any help would be g=
reatly appreciated as she is really a spunky
<BR>>>>>>>> little girl.
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Mahalo, Sherron=20
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
<BR>>>>>>> From: Gecko <gecko.hale@gmail.com>
<BR>>>>>>> To: gecko@lists.gekkota.com
<BR>>>>>>> Sent: Mon, 2 Jun 2008 11:21 am
<BR>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [gecko]Question on hatchling Gold=20=
Dust Day Gecko=20
<BR>>>>>>> having trouble shedding ...
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Aloha, Elizabeth
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> She is about 3/4" from nose to vent -- she is t=
he smallest day=20
<BR>>>>>>> gecko hatchling we have ever seen, although som=
e of our mourning=20
<BR>>>>>>> gecko hatchlings are even tinier.
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> This sounds like it might work! If it wou=
ld just soften enough=20
<BR>>>>>>> to pull off her or get a split started, I think=
we could get the=20
<BR>>>>>>> neck skin off. We have been misting her l=
ittle cage and putting=20
<BR>>>>>>> a heating pad next to it, but that only helps a=
little and wasn't=20
<BR>>>>>>> keeping the humidity up high enough.
<BR>>>>>>> She has never seemed to be able to fully contro=
l her right leg,=20
<BR>>>>>>> and her right foot is smaller than her left and=
the toes kind of=20
<BR>>>>>>> clumped together. She often tends to move the j=
oint and leg=20
<BR>>>>>>> together as a unit, so there may be something w=
rong with the=20
<BR>>>>>>> joint, too. Although in watching her with the s=
kin problem, some=20
<BR>>>>>>> of that may just be the skin being so tight it=20=
restricts her=20
<BR>>>>>>> movement.
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Usually when we find the hatchlings, most of th=
at first skin has=20
<BR>>>>>>> already been shed, but she was fully covered wi=
th it and it has=20
<BR>>>>>>> only recently started splitting. We do think it=
hinders her use=20
<BR>>>>>>> of her limbs -- her arms are only about the siz=
e of thin pencil=20
<BR>>>>>>> lead, and the skin seems to fully coat those.
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> She has been doing okay up until the last coupl=
e of days, though,=20
<BR>>>>>>> when the skin (I hope that it isn't something e=
lse, too) started=20
<BR>>>>>>> really becoming a problem. She now gets around=20=
by lurching her=20
<BR>>>>>>> body back and forth because her little arms &am=
p; legs are still=20
<BR>>>>>>> encased in the skin, although it has come off s=
ome of the back.
<BR>>>>>>> And she is green underneath, not gray!
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> We haven't ever actually kept any of the geckos=
before, as they=20
<BR>>>>>>> run all around our house, lanai and garden (Phe=
lsuma laticauda,=20
<BR>>>>>>> house - Hemidactylus frenatus, & Mourning -=
Lepidodactylus=20
<BR>>>>>>> lugubris). But we had to make an exception in h=
er case, since she=20
<BR>>>>>>> couldn't fend for herself. Usually we just take=
the hatchlings=20
<BR>>>>>>> outside so they have a better chance of surviva=
l -- we have lots=20
<BR>>>>>>> of big geckos running around inside and they do=
n't last long if=20
<BR>>>>>>> we don't get to them first. :(
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> Mahalo, Sherron
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>> ElizabethFreer@aol.com wrote:
<BR>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Hello Sherron ~
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Try the humidity chamber trick. I can=
't view your photos at=20
<BR>>>>>>>> home because my laptop is really memory-cha=
llenged, so I don't=20
<BR>>>>>>>> know how big this gecko is! However,=20=
my mourning geckos are 1"=20
<BR>>>>>>>> 3/8" at hatching. Try placing your ge=
cko in a vented plastic=20
<BR>>>>>>>> container with a damp washcloth inside. &nb=
sp;Place this near a=20
<BR>>>>>>>> light. Almost immediately you will no=
tice beads of water=20
<BR>>>>>>>> accumulate on the sides/top of the containe=
r. After a few hours=20
<BR>>>>>>>> or so perhaps you can remove the rings of o=
ld skin around her=20
<BR>>>>>>>> neck gently with a tweezers or small scisso=
rs.
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> What is the problem with her right leg? &nb=
sp;Might you have a new=20
<BR>>>>>>>> pet here?
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Elizabeth
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>>> Subj:[gecko]Question on hatchling Gold=20=
Dust Day Gecko having=20
<BR>>>>>>>>> trouble shedding "egg skin"
<BR>>>>>>>>> Date:6/1/08 4:16:39 PM Pacific Daylight=
Time
<BR>>>>>>>>> From: gecko.hale@gmai=
l.com (Sherron)
<BR>>>>>>>>> Sender: gecko-admin@l=
ists.gekkota.com
<BR>>>>>>>>> Reply-to: gecko@lists.gekkota.com <m=
ailto:gecko@lists.gekkota.com>
<BR>>>>>>>>> To: gecko@lists.gekko=
ta.com
<BR>>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> We found a tiny hatchling on May 13 that wa=
s a little=20
<BR>>>>>>>> underdeveloped and was still in that grayis=
h skin they have when=20
<BR>>>>>>>> they first come out of the shell. She was d=
ehydrated and has a=20
<BR>>>>>>>> problem with her right leg, but is spunky.
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> We haven't been able to release her outside=
like we do the rest=20
<BR>>>>>>>> of the hatchings we find, as her bad leg ha=
s kept her from being=20
<BR>>>>>>>> very mobile, but she has been doing pretty=20=
well eating tiny bugs=20
<BR>>>>>>>> & aphids I collect for her. She has als=
o shown a real interest=20
<BR>>>>>>>> in the fruit flies around her papaya, but I=
don't think she has=20
<BR>>>>>>>> managed to catch any yet.
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> But she started having trouble yesterday an=
d was real cold &=20
<BR>>>>>>>> clammy, so we put a heating pad near her ca=
ge to help warm her=20
<BR>>>>>>>> up. It seems to have started her molting he=
r "egg skin", but she=20
<BR>>>>>>>> has a bunch of it around her neck that she=20=
can't get off.
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Is there anything we can do to help her? Sh=
e is so tiny we don't=20
<BR>>>>>>>> see how we could try to cut it off! The res=
t of the skin except=20
<BR>>>>>>>> for around her neck should slough off okay,=
but the stuff around=20
<BR>>>>>>>> her neck is several layers and is a ring, s=
o it may be another=20
<BR>>>>>>>> matter. :(
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Any help would be greatly appreciated as sh=
e is really a spunky=20
<BR>>>>>>>> little girl.
<BR>>>>>>>>
<BR>>>>>>>> Mahalo, Sherron</BLOCKQUOTE>
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ANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE>
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